Transcript Help and Hindrance in Apprentice Progression to HE

Help and
Hindrance
in
Apprentice
Progression to
HE
David E Berry
Tamsin Bowers-Brown
Building Pathways Role
• Focus on developing progression routes to
HE for modern apprentices
• BP action plan - interview apprentices at
Colleges across South Yorkshire & NE
Derbyshire
– Assess numbers ready to progress to HE
– Do apprentices consider progression to a
HE course a viable option ?
– Assess barriers apprentices perceive in
progression
Hindrances identified by
• Conducting interviews with Apprenticeship
students at Building Pathways partner
colleges.
 44 interviews were conducted with
apprentices
 Twelve further interviews were conducted
with apprentices who had progressed to
higher education courses (HNC and HND) at
the same colleges.
Hindrances
•Financial Issues
•Perceived Advantages of HE
•Employer Issues
•Apprentice Awareness
•Expectations / Capability
•Employer Caution
Defining Hindrances
Research findings show that
 employer support
 time
 finance and
 apprentices’ perceptions of their own ability
are some of the key factors that determine
whether apprentices will progress to higherlevel courses.
What do apprentices want?
• Many wanted to go straight into
work
• Some wanted to progress to HE
immediately
• HE is opportunity they may
“take up later on.”
£
• Many felt that they would earn more
in non-managerial roles
-> unsure about taking higher-level skills
-> relate to monetary gain. ?
• Indication they were unsure about
funding
-> clearer information about fees would
help them to make a decision on
progression.
“£”
• It depends on the work situation, but if I’m
being paid to train again I’ll go for any
qualifications they offer me
• It is very expensive. I probably would if I have
chance
• I don’t like the idea of being in debt to any
company whether it is student loan or not.
Too many people got problems with it.
“£”
•I’m not sure who pays, I thought it were us
who had to pay for it, I’m not right sure. It
depends, because a lot of people are
subcontracting now, so if you’re
subcontracting, you have to pay yourself.
•I don’t know if it’d be day release because
I’d still need money coming in, so that’s
probably the only thing that would do it for
me.
Perceived advantages of HE
• Job opportunities - becoming a foreman
or a manager
• Gain employment abroad.
• Many apprentices felt that they would
earn more in non-managerial roles
->unsure about taking higher level skills.
Employer Lottery
responses varied greatly depending on the
employer for whom apprentices worked
The employers have signed us up already, me and two
other lads, to do the HNC, starting in September.
They've allowed me to have flexible working patterns so
I can attend day release courses, also they've paid for
me to complete the HND so that's been very supportive.
Yes - they're prepared to support me through the HNC,
and maybe the degree as well. They pushed me to
complete (the apprenticeship) and assisted with the
programme work.
• I wouldn’t mind moving on. I’ve had a chat
with work but they say if they do let me, it’s
going to be about three years, but I’ll have
to sign a contract saying I’ll stop on for five
years, but that’s only if the bosses let me.
Apprentice Awareness
• Several indicated that they heard about
higher qual opportunities from college
tutors.
• many apprentices could give a vague
description.
• few able to articulate clearly options for
progression.
• They haven't been too good with that one I've had to do all the steps to do the HNC
by myself.
• We were just in the classroom with the
lecturer. He was telling us how you can go
up to the advanced … well, it’s something
different to the advanced.
Expectations / Capability
• I don’t intend to go into the management
side because I don’t think I’m
management material, so I’ll just stick to
being on the tool side of things. So,
obviously, I think it (higher education)
would help me if I wanted to go that way
later on in life.
• I don’t really want to go for a higher
course, because I’ll find it a bit more
difficult and I’m finding it quite hard with
one I’m on already, so I think it would be a
bit too complicated for me to do the next
course up.
• I sometimes wonder whether I'm in the
right business and whether I should be
thinking about getting out, rather than
getting on. A lot of the older blokes at our
place keep saying things like "What’s a
young bloke like you wasting your time in
a job like this? Engineering is a dying
trade. There’s no future in it."
Employer caution
• There was also a concern that employers
would not allow apprentices to progress to
higher levels of study to prevent them from
becoming equally or more qualified.
• Concern was expressed that employees
who had gained higher qualifications might
leave the firm
•No, they want you at work earning them money.
They don’t want you studying or doing something
that’s going to lead to you walking out on them
once you’ve finished your studying, because that’s
how they see it, you taking their job.
•They don’t want you to take their jobs, so no, they
won’t support you, they won’t pay for it or anything.
If they found out you had to have a day off in the
middle of the week they’d definitely be like, no
way.
Help ! ?
• Progression pathways
• Apprentice profiles
• CD Rom – progression
information & opportunities
• Database development
Help ! ?
• Map out the progression in existing routes
– as seen from the Colleges perspective
• Consider the form, mode & level of study
available
• Provide information on
progression possibilities
progression pathways
career enhancement opps
Information –
clarification & provision
• Mapping of course structures – at N.
Derbyshire & South Yorkshire Colleges
• Discussing progression pathways
available with key staff in colleges
• Checking outline progression mapping for
clarification
• Progression pathways diagrams
database development
• HE in FE
• Level 3 provision & progression
• Vocational provision &
progression to HE
Questions ?
then
ACTIVITY